Lets be clear, Zip Zap SEs have improved

crazydave · Post by **crazydave** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:37 am

Ok, I remember reading a couple people saying their new SEs kicked ass. I figure if this true, then it deserves its own thread. So we can all be clear about this.

See I want to make sure its clear, because I'm sure I'm not the only one that kept buying one of each new batch of SEs, hearing they were improved, only to remain disappointed. I'm sure many of us have added up what we've spent on SEs, and decided it was not worth risking again.

Well that was my stand point, but after reading about codesuidae's DC (Duty Cycle) mod, I got interested. The motor is being switch on and off rapidly to get proportional control, and at full throttle they are not on 100% of the time. Apparently the old SEs were running at about a 30% DC, so they were off 70% of the time! The newer ones run about 55% (according to code's findings), which puts them about track with a OG Zip zap, since it has a 2.4v power source, it outputs about 1.5v.

So I broke down and got me a new SE. The new Mustang and Vette bodies look so good, I couldn't decide. I had to get me my Vette in the end though. It sits a bit high on the chassis, but it has plenty of room to lower it. Its gonna look great after I lower it.

It does indeed perform as well as a OG Zip Zap. First I tested it stock. Instant acceleration, pretty fast. So i threw a Pefection 3.8 in there to see how it handled it. Even my FET modded SEs before could not pull a 3.8 to full speed. Not so with this SE. it still punch, and had good top speed. So I threw so green 9.86:1 gears in there. Still punching. I honestly think it may be just a tad stronger than an OG Zip Zap. The steering was nice a smooth too. Absolutely no jitters what so ever. Good runtime too. Pulling 3 charges off the controller, the battery wasn't even warm, and I managed over 10 minutes of constant running.

I still need to try some FETs in it. I'm hoping it'll easily pull red gears with FETs. I aslo have a DC mod I need to figure out how to hook up. Since that runs at a 100% Duty Cycle, I supposed to kick like a dual celled car. (Since it is essentially a dual cell car.

)

So don't give up on the SE just yet. Its worth a second try, in my opinion.

hue35 · Post by **hue35** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 10:59 am

Well... damn. Maybe I'll have to try one of the new ones. If these are finally worth drivin', maybe it will be time to modify a controller so my hands can actually work the damn thing.

Thanks for the review, crazydave.

LBRC · Post by **LBRC** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 3:25 pm

Absolutely concur! Mostly because of steering and throttle control I’d given up on the SE’s. Power and speed I could fix, but the older SE steering was like a good looking chick with a hygiene problem ya just don’t feel like hanging around all that long.

I unwrapped a Vette and wow RS scrubbed her down and gave her a few shots of penicillin, so I ran back and got a Shelby, since they’re always more fun in pairs even if you can only play with one at a time.

Haven’t tried any of the others, basically if it doesn’t have a 05 on the bottom of the package I don’t really feel like taking a risk.

A new SE with nothing more than wide tires, a better steering wheel, and the NX motor is a blast on my Epoch track (10’x 12’).

crazydave · Post by **crazydave** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 6:30 pm

LBRC wrote: A new SE with nothing more than wide tires, a better steering wheel, and the NX motor is a blast on my Epoch track (10’x 12’).

Yep, totally. My kitchen is about 4'x9', so I got a little less room, but I stuck some fatties in back, and it gave it enough push, that when I floored it, it would make 3ft. sweeping turns, then if I backed off the throttle a little, it would do nice tight 6 inch wide turns. Just the way I like a car to handle.

Hue, yeah that controller still needs some work.

LBRC's Xmod wheel mod would probably be a good place to start though.

That handle I made out of Crayola modeling foam ended up cracking off, because I didn't make it with enough material to hold it on. It could have probably been made to work though. I'm thinking of making a plastic box to slide over the handle, and covering that with foam. I'll let you guys know how that works out.

Namuna · Post by **Namuna** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 6:48 pm

The Shack should take a queue from Takara's Digi-Propo Special controller and come out with a 'specialized' controller for the SEs as an accessory upgrade.

- Make it a pistol grip
- adjustable throttle/steering trim

I'd be all over that like a monkey on a cookie.

Post by **CaboWabo** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 6:56 pm

Namuna wrote:I'd be all over that like a monkey on a cookie.

Yup.
I'd be on that like ugly on a Baldwin brother.

LBRC · Post by **LBRC** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:06 pm

I was thinking about heading down to the local sporting goods store and seeing if I could find an aftermarket pistol grip that I could screw onto a controller. Something like a Hogue Mono Grip.

Bird · Post by **Bird** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:45 pm

Damn, I bought a Herbie and one of the SE 'Vettes a few weeks ago and stuck them on the pile and haven't bothered with them... maybe I need to bust out that 'Vette and check it out... I've been pretty happy with the Chevelle chassis(hell, the Savanna chassis I got aint all that bad either), so if they improved them even more, well shit then!

I'm fully agreeing with yall on the trasmitter issue, something larger/more comfy is a definate must... I'm all for modding the existing one, but Namunas idea is killer... maybe we should petition the 'Shaq for a real TX...

crazydave · Post by **crazydave** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 10:55 pm

Hell yeah, that controller idea is pretty great. They should be paying you for that shit, Namuna.

Another bonus would be if it came with a stand alone wall charger. Save us on batteries RS, I mean I know that's how you make money and all, but damn, cut us some slack.

I stuck some FETs in mine tonight. At first running the same green gears and 3.8 motor I thought it didn't seem drastically different. Still not popping wheelies, or anything like that, but the I noticed I was hardly using full throttle, so I tried to floor it for a couple laps, and it was hard to control. So the FETs definately did something. I think it's smoother at partial throttle.

Hey Bird, get that car out, if you were happy with the Chevelle, you're gonna love this.

MotorGong · Post by **MotorGong** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 11:44 pm

LBRC wrote:Haven’t tried any of the others, basically if it doesn’t have a 05 on the bottom of the package I don’t really feel like taking a risk.

Okay, I had a similar experience. My first ZZSE purchase was the 'on sale' Savannah only 2 months ago. The kids in my neighborhood wanted to get in on the action, so they all bought SEs. They come over with the green and red Shelbys, and thier doin' spinouts and circles around my 'upgraded' Savannah. Then, I found out about the '3rd generation SEs'.
There are more newer models out to add to this list, like the Corvette Stingray 60-7072.
This list I found was obviously compiled prior:

-White 2005 Ford GT
Catalog #: 60-7050

-Navy 2005 Ford GT
Catalog #: 60-7051

-2003 Red Chevrolet Corvette C5
Catalog #: 60-7048

-Orange Ford Mustang Mach I
Catalog #: 60-7054

-2003 Yellow Chevrolet Corvette C5
Catalog #: 60-7049

-Green 1967 Ford Shelby GT-500
Catalog #: 60-7070

-Red 1967 Ford Shelby GT-500
Catalog #: 60-7071

-Red Dodge Viper
Catalog #: 60-7052

-Black Dodge Viper
Catalog #: 60-7053

However, I own a NIB Red Dodge Viper, bottom of the box says 08A04, and I can tell it still has the 'round-ended' motor, not like the 'square-ended' motors that come with the latest models, seemingly the ones that have '05' at the bottom. I want to try it out, to see if it has all the performance of an '05' square-motor SE, but I'm still deciding whether or not to easily return it to RS for an even newer model.
I also believe this is the last model to have round-ended motors, and hence RS discontinues all of thier upgrade kits besides 60-7551, which contains all square-end motors and new-style heatsinks.

EDIT: As far as the controllers, doesn't RS know that everyone doesn't have little baby fingers?!

crazydave · Post by **crazydave** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 8:32 am

You know, everyone's been calling these new ones 3rd generation, but I consider it 4th generation.

The original were the Initial D RX7s. Those came out at Christmas time. Then there was the midseason, concept Mustang and Audi TT. Those had slightly improved steering and throttle. Then there was the S&H Torino, GTO, and Chevelle. Those further improved the throttle, and just about got the steering right (But not quite). Those came out in time for Christmas. So that's 3 batches. It seems like the Vipers and the '66 Vettes are from the same batch, but if motorgong is seeing the round endbell motor with the Viper, then they are probably different.

So would that make 5 generations, or do we go by the year it was released? If that is the case, wouldn't it be 2nd generation? Have SEs been out 2 full years yet. I don't know I forget.

I'm all confused now.

civicsr2cool · Post by **civicsr2cool** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 9:02 am

crazydave wrote:Another bonus would be if it came with a stand alone wall charger. Save us on batteries RS, I mean I know that's how you make money and all, but damn, cut us some slack.

it took me a whole 5 miutes after i got mine and i said fuck going through 4 batts every few minutes. i came up with this:

i use a 4.5 volt wall plug from my old sony walkman. i have to take the batts out though before i plug it in or the batts go boom!(forgot once!) alls i did was hook the plug into the lead on the little tabs that grab power from the batt holder. i was gonna put a switch on it so i ddnt have to take out the batts but i went lipo before i ever got around to using it too much. i have also done this on the mt controller but that went lipo too

crazydave · Post by **crazydave** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 9:43 am

Yeah, I got a stand alone I made for my SEs from a Motorwork's base. I was talking about something that would program the car's 6 frequencies too. A peak detection, or decent cutoff time would be nice too.

I'm probably just day dreaming, but I think RS could easily sell something like that, if they kept it around $15-20.

MotorGong · Post by **MotorGong** » Sat Jun 25, 2005 11:38 pm

crazydave wrote: It seems like the Vipers and the '66 Vettes are from the same batch, but if motorgong is seeing the round endbell motor with the Viper, then they are probably different.
So would that make 5 generations, or do we go by the year it was released? If that is the case, wouldn't it be 2nd generation? Have SEs been out 2 full years yet. I don't know I forget.

I'm all confused now.

Dave, me too. I just looked at the NIB red Dodge Viper that I mentioned before, CLOSER. I knew it had the round bell end motor, however I've never seen an 'end' of a motor like this before! Nothing like the usual end of a ZZ motor.
Although the end is round, the 'connects?' or 'solder?' at the ends (help out a noob on his terminology here) is a THICK SQUARE.

Perhaps somebody also has this model ZZ, or has seen a motor end like this.
Then again, maybe this style is known amongst the seasoned vets, and it's something I just havn't seen before.

1. I'll get the crappola digicam workin', and see if I can't snap a shot.
2. I got this sucka of E-Bay for approx. $9.50 incl. shipping, so I'm thinkin' screw it.....let's pop this baby open!! Especially if it brings even a hint of knowledgeable resolve to the "ZZSE Generation" conversation here.

betty.k · Post by **betty.k** » Sun Jun 26, 2005 8:26 am

i know those motors, if you pry that big hunk of metal off the end it reveals the regular terminal underneath. no idea why they did that

i got one with my torino which had vastly improved steering over the 1st gen chassis i bought off ph2t way back when. not sure about torque, the 1st i got was fet modded but the newer one wasn't much slower.